ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

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Voltron
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ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by Voltron »

Hello, fellow Linux Minters and other Linux users:

I just found this article on ExtremeTech:

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/2017 ... ng-systems

At the very least, this appears to be a case of throwing the baby out with the bath water. Beyond that, it may simply be proof that Linux's popularity is starting to really be noticed by the big corporate, for-profit tech companies. Let the discussion begin...
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by jimallyn »

Lawsuit?
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by tdockery97 »

Under this scenario, a laptop that does not allow secure boot to be disabled will allow Ubuntu (as one example) to be installed, but will not allow Linux Mint and many other distros to be installed in their default configuration. You can bet that the distros that presently require secure boot to be disabled in order to install will fix that problem quickly if too many hardware manufacturers elect to remove the capability of disabling secure boot.

So in the end I really don't see any reason at all to be concerned.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by Pierre »

it's still a very unknown area,
as win_10 is still in beta & won't be final, for a while yet.

as with win_8 - there was a howl of protests, from everywhere & M$ backed off,
from making it mandatory. - They may yet do that again. :twisted:

they are mainly targeting RT / mobile phones/ tablets/ and to a lesser degree laptops / desktops.
- they are very keen to lock people into M$ store, by competing directly with google store & apple store.

but: it's still to early to tell. ..
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by killer de bug »

jimallyn wrote:Lawsuit?
In the EU, this will probably not be allowed. Bruxelles will kill a manufacturer doing this :)
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by Jedinovice »

When this came up in 2008 somebody pointed out that most laptops these days are manufactuered by the Chinese...

who are very heavily pro-Linux.

I also expect this to fall foul of a great many anti-monopoly laws worldwide.
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Windows 10 and Bios restrictions project

Post by guwrt »

Hello,

Yesterday, I read on the internet that Microsoft would like restrict the installation of new OS on some computers by activating by default SECURE BOOT.

What do we have to think about this?

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/2017 ... ng-systems

Guwrt
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by dXTC »

As if I needed another reason to avoid buying a new prefab system from one of the major vendors, what with their bloatware and obnoxious use of proprietary case hardware that requires expensive upgrades (I'm looking at you, Dell! ). I've built a PC from scratch before, and I can certainly do it again.

I foresee some hardware manufacturers using this to their advantage; for example, they could charge more for a Secure-Boot-disabled motherboard than its otherwise identical SB-locked version. The ones that keep the prices the same, though, will get my business-- and a lot of others' as well, I suspect.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by nuagedeboucane »

Crappy handcuffs :evil:
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by var »

I must admit, I do like secureboot. I know many in the community don't (especially the greybeards from the 70's). If we are to get linux more popular, growing with changes and adapting to them is required.

I've always been puzzled why Mint doesn't plonk down a one time fee of 99$ to get secureboot capable?

And yes in the EU this wouldn't be allowed and a manufacturer would be slapped with fines for this most likely.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by linxmintq »

But the machines with Windows 8.1 are becoming obsolete and there will be no spare parts. In my point of view I think that Linux Mint should work to be layers of operate in secure boot with the UEFI activated.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by SC23 »

I just hope the hactivists keep up and have some bios flashes once that lock down day comes because, if the only option is to "secure boot" then that is the door closing on the computing kingdom.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by SWIN »

I just hope the hactivists keep up and have some bios flashes once that lock down day comes because, if the only option is to "secure boot" then that is the door closing on the computing kingdom.
And as a n00b, I have always thought that a network capable "secure boot" BIOS is a open back door for NSA...put in whatever OS you want, you are still hacked, watched and monitored.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by InkKnife »

var wrote:I must admit, I do like secureboot. I know many in the community don't (especially the greybeards from the 70's). If we are to get linux more popular, growing with changes and adapting to them is required.

I've always been puzzled why Mint doesn't plonk down a one time fee of 99$ to get secureboot capable?

And yes in the EU this wouldn't be allowed and a manufacturer would be slapped with fines for this most likely.
I can see the utility of secure boot is certain circumstances but SB offers nothing to the home or small business user. Rootkits are quite rare in the wild and generally very specialized in their targeting. The overwhelming majority of malware out there will be utterly unaffected by secureboot.
The logic of secureboot simply does not work unless you include the way it locks out other operating systems because secure boot will solve a tiny number of problems compared to what it will cause.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by Jedinovice »

InkKnife wrote:
var wrote:I must admit, I do like secureboot. I know many in the community don't (especially the greybeards from the 70's). If we are to get linux more popular, growing with changes and adapting to them is required.

I've always been puzzled why Mint doesn't plonk down a one time fee of 99$ to get secureboot capable?

And yes in the EU this wouldn't be allowed and a manufacturer would be slapped with fines for this most likely.
I can see the utility of secure boot is certain circumstances but SB offers nothing to the home or small business user. Rootkits are quite rare in the wild and generally very specialized in their targeting. The overwhelming majority of malware out there will be utterly unaffected by secureboot.
The logic of secureboot simply does not work unless you include the way it locks out other operating systems because secure boot will solve a tiny number of problems compared to what it will cause.
Unless the 'bug' "locking out other operating systems" is actually the primary feature.
Given there are so few security attacks this would prevent, SB seems to be about something else in reality. Just like the sheer amount of data sent to Microsoft, including keystrokes, to be about something other than solving technical problems.
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Re: ExtremeTech Article: Linux’s Worst-Case Scenario

Post by English Invader »

var wrote:I must admit, I do like secureboot. I know many in the community don't (especially the greybeards from the 70's). If we are to get linux more popular, growing with changes and adapting to them is required.

I've always been puzzled why Mint doesn't plonk down a one time fee of 99$ to get secureboot capable?

And yes in the EU this wouldn't be allowed and a manufacturer would be slapped with fines for this most likely.
I think Mint (and any self-respecting Linux distro) should boycott Secure Boot on principle.

Dell is one of (if not the) most Linux-friendly manufacturers there is (a Dell laptop/desktop with Intel processor and graphics is as close to a sure thing as you'll get) so hopefully they'll keep up that reputation by leaving an option to disable Secure Boot.

I'm a home-built desktop kind of guy but I also like a laptop on my coffee table when I want to relax in front of the sofa so manufacturers are still relevant to me.

The suggestion that not allowing users to disable SB would reduce the amount of support calls they get is laughable. I imagine anyone intelligent enough to boot a Linux distro would also know that manufacturer support lines are useless :lol: .
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